Anderson Silva vs. Quinton Jackson

[rivethead]

Originally Posted by Intellectual

i got Quinton winning this. I dont see quinton getting submitted, and i dont see him having too much trouble stand up wise. Anderon has to be very aggressive to win this fight.

I don't think a lot of people saw Henderson getting submitted either. It's MMA math, but I don't think Jackson can bring this fight anywhere that Silva isn't better.

Originally Posted by Afro

The thing with Quinton Jackson is logically you would expect Anderson Silva to be the better striker

but so was Cyrill Abidi, and Quinton knocked him out and then beat him in a decision..

Quinton is a lot bigger then Anderson is, I think he'll be able to use his wrestling to win the fight. I wouldnt count on Quinton trying to stand with A Silva but.. he can probably hold his own.

I think Size and Wrestling wins this for Quinton, if it were at 185 the edge would be smaller but at 205.. its Quintons fight.

K1 math? I think you're overlooking the fact that Abidi had no ground game for Jackson to be concerned about, and while Silva has no TD skills--so that might be a push there--I don't feel Jackson's grappling is any better than Henderson's. Abidi was able to react to Jackson's style better in the second fight; I think Silva would be able to, as well; and he's well-versed in all aspects of the fight. Again, I don't think Jackson can bring it anywhere Silva is not both comfortable and accomplished.

Ultimately, I think it's a great, very close fight. If he got an immediate titleshot at LHW--meaning it's Silva's first fight at LHW in the UFC, I'd give the nod to Jackson, [60/40]. If Anderson gets a chance to fight at LHW first and get accustomed to the weight difference and continues to train with Big Nog not only in boxing but in submissions, I'd give the nod to Silva [70/30].

I think Jackson's weakness in the clinch stands out more profoundly than any weakness Silva has...certainly, Anderson doesn't have world-class TDD, but his ground game has been underrated by his critics. And while people talk about how much Jackson has improved in the clinch, I really haven't seen evidence of it yet. I'm not saying he hasn't improved, I'm just saying a fight with Anderson would minimally force him to showcase that. It will be interesting to see what Griffin eventually brings as a fight plan...my opinion could change based on the outcome of that fight.

rh

[dbader08]

the difference between rampage and hendo is...

rampage wouldn't get caught as easily standing up like hendo...rampage has really good striking defense and better overall striking than hendo...he doesn't throw haymakers like hendo either he's really good technically...

i think he can hold his own against silva and take him down also...

it would be an awesome fight it's at 50/50 for me

[Intellectual]

Originally Posted by rivethead

I don't think a lot of people saw Henderson getting submitted either. It's MMA math, but I don't think Jackson can bring this fight anywhere that Silva isn't better.



K1 math? I think you're overlooking the fact that Abidi had no ground game for Jackson to be concerned about, and while Silva has no TD skills--so that might be a push there--I don't feel Jackson's grappling is any better than Henderson's. Abidi was able to react to Jackson's style better in the second fight; I think Silva would be able to, as well; and he's well-versed in all aspects of the fight. Again, I don't think Jackson can bring it anywhere Silva is not both comfortable and accomplished.

Ultimately, I think it's a great, very close fight. If he got an immediate titleshot at LHW--meaning it's Silva's first fight at LHW in the UFC, I'd give the nod to Jackson, [60/40]. If Anderson gets a chance to fight at LHW first and get accustomed to the weight difference and continues to train with Big Nog not only in boxing but in submissions, I'd give the nod to Silva [70/30].

I think Jackson's weakness in the clinch stands out more profoundly than any weakness Silva has...certainly, Anderson doesn't have world-class TDD, but his ground game has been underrated by his critics. And while people talk about how much Jackson has improved in the clinch, I really haven't seen evidence of it yet. I'm not saying he hasn't improved, I'm just saying a fight with Anderson would minimally force him to showcase that. It will be interesting to see what Griffin eventually brings as a fight plan...my opinion could change based on the outcome of that fight.

rh

i wasn't surprised at all that Anderson submited Hendo. I would have been more surprised if he KO'd him. i said this in another thread as well.

as for Rampage, i'll stick with him in this match up.

[POINDEXTER]

I think Silva exemplifies the attributes that brought Rampage down in the past. You can argue that Rampage is a different fighter now, but I till don't think we've seen him face the type of clinches that destroyed him in the past. Silva takes this.

[Problematique]

Rampage ftw.

[Silverburst00]

I got Rampage on this one

[Ramma]

I've gone back and forth on this one for a while...

but I give it to Anderson.

Rampage's track record with good Muay Thai fighters (Shogun, Wandy, even Ninja [as far as I'm concerned, Rampage lost.. and as far as Rampage is concerned... Rampage lost) isn't what I would call remotely good.

Anderson has equal or better Muay Thai than all of those ex-Chute Box fighters.

Anderson via (T)KO in round 2.



For those who say Rampage has improved his clinch.. he has shown me nothing that would indicate his getting in the clinch with a great Muay Thai fighter going ANY differently. Cro Cop has shown improved clinch work too... but if he tried to go into the clinch with Wanderlei, he'd be smelling the smelling salt not too long after.

^ Feel free to prove me wrong and give some examples, but I have not seen it.

[Masscore]

I was thinking this over, thought it would be a great fight, but I am giving it to Rampage. Yes, I know the clinch is his weak spot, but I think you guys are all forgetting something. Silva is not nearly as strong as Shogun and Wandy. Both those guys cut wieght to get down to 205 and Silva wieghs about 200. Holding Rich Franklin in a clinch is one thing, holding Rampage who by fight time would out wiegh you by about 20 or more pounds of muscle is different. So I think if the clinch did come into play Rampage would be able to power out of it.

Also comparing Rivera's punching power to Rampage's punching power is like comparing getting hit by a S-10 and getting hit by a mack truck. They both hurt, but one for sure is probably going to kill ya. Rampage hits very very hard, just ask Liddell who has one of the best chins in the sport. Rampage flattened him out with one soild punch. He may not be the overall better striker, but he also hits a lot harder then Silva and more importantly hits harder then anyone Silva has ever fought.

Finally I think he could take Silva down without much trouble and control him the ground and do damage. The last thing Silva is going to do from the bottom is go for a triangle choke, not unless he wants to get power bombed. So I think he would just try to tie Rampage up.

In the end I think Rampage is just too much and stops Silva in the 3rd.

[Ramma]

Originally Posted by Masscore

I was thinking this over, thought it would be a great fight, but I am giving it to Rampage. Yes, I know the clinch is his weak spot, but I think you guys are all forgetting something. Silva is not nearly as strong as Shogun and Wandy. Both those guys cut wieght to get down to 205 and Silva wieghs about 200. Holding Rich Franklin in a clinch is one thing, holding Rampage who by fight time would out wiegh you by about 20 or more pounds of muscle is different. So I think if the clinch did come into play Rampage would be able to power out of it.

I never hear about Shogun's strength. Also, the clinch isn't exactly a power technique. From experience, there are plenty of stronger guys than me at my MT school and if I clinch up, they don't just push me off.

Anderson's clinch > Wanderlei's and Shogun's, IMO

Not to mention, Rampage gets into the clinch and does nothing to get out, he actually tries to trade knees instead.

Also, plenty of smaller guys have done fine with Rampage (Ninja, Hendo, Bustamante and Lindland, to name a few.. all of which happen to be middleweights). All MWs have brought Rampage to a decision and a close one. Most (Rampage included) think Ninja beat him. Many think Hendo and Lindland beat Rampage as well.

All smaller guys, all gave Rampage a run for his money. It isn't like Shogun is huge either. I could even mention Sakuraba and Eastman, 2 Natural MWs with wins over him.

Bottom line, Quinton's size advantage has meant much against smaller fighters. I don't think that is really a debatable opinion, it is a fact.

Also comparing Rivera's punching power to Rampage's punching power is like comparing getting hit by a S-10 and getting hit by a mack truck. They both hurt, but one for sure is probably going to kill ya. Rampage hits very very hard, just ask Liddell who has one of the best chins in the sport. Rampage flattened him out with one soild punch. He may not be the overall better striker, but he also hits a lot harder then Silva and more importantly hits harder then anyone Silva has ever fought.

I beg to differ. Maybe he punches harder.. but hits harder? Silva pretty much dropped Hendo with his knee, Jackson never did that to Hendo with his fist. Hell, even Wanderlei rocked Hendo, but Hendo kind of balled up for a second, he didn't make his way to the ground.

I don't think Rampage's kicks are any comparison to Anderson's either, considering Rampage rarely even throws a leg kick.

Elbows.. yeah, I think we know Anderson elbows a hell of a lot harder.

Is power really an issue? Anderson doesn't get hit lol. He is faster than Rampage. Don't get me wrong, Rampage could KO Anderson, but he has to hit him first. Anderson has fought many guys with KO power before.

Quinton has stronger punches and Anderson has stronger everything else (nice sentence, I know).

Also, if Franklin hits a guy on the button, they go to sleep. Same for Hendo and even Leben.

Hendo hit Anderson with a nice shot, and Anderson shrugged it off.

Finally I think he could take Silva down without much trouble and control him the ground and do damage. The last thing Silva is going to do from the bottom is go for a triangle choke, not unless he wants to get power bombed. So I think he would just try to tie Rampage up.

In the end I think Rampage is just too much and stops Silva in the 3rd.

I agree that Rampage could take Silva down, however.. it seems like the last two guys who took Anderson down and tried that game, ended up getting submitted. Those two guys being great grapplers in Hendo and Lutter.

[Arkanj0]

Originally Posted by Afro

The thing with Quinton Jackson is logically you would expect Anderson Silva to be the better striker

but so was Cyrill Abidi, and Quinton knocked him out and then beat him in a decision..

Quinton is a lot bigger then Anderson is, I think he'll be able to use his wrestling to win the fight. I wouldnt count on Quinton trying to stand with A Silva but.. he can probably hold his own.

I think Size and Wrestling wins this for Quinton, if it were at 185 the edge would be smaller but at 205.. its Quintons fight.

Cyrill who? Who did he beat? Don't answer that, it's a rhetorical question. The guy is almost a can, and actually he fought Quinton 2 times, with Quinton's win by decision being the most recent.

And Quinton isn't a lot bigger than Anderson. They both have similar size with Anderson being a bit taller and having bigger reach. Anderson's body frame is indeed smaller than Rampage's, but if Rampage cut down to 185, they would look similar. In fact, I heard Anderson walks around at 212. Also Anderson's long limbs may play to his advantage.

I have Anderson winning this.

Why? Rampage was destroyed by Wanderlei and Shogun, both Chute Boxe fighters, which Anderson also happens to be. Not to mention the fact that Silva has never been KOed or even rocked.

Also, Hendo did very well against Rampage in stand up and look what happened to him against Silva.