Mac's top 10 overrated fighters

[BigBanda]

Originally Posted by willpunisher

alright than here we go lol

no particular order and all my opinion!
Tyson Griffin - rogan is a kickass saying everyone in the division is scared once joe silva silva says he got a fight but when they mention Tyson they back out.
Okami - no he cannot beat or stop anderson,
Kimbo - he has only fought shitty fighters and early stoppage against thompson
Randy - too hyped, KO'ed 2x by chuck, no he cannot beat Fedor and no he would not stop Nog.
Chuck - i think he is a lucky puncher, he was blessed with a heavy hand. lucky him.
Florian
Hughes - no stand up, takes it to the ground and lays on top.
Franklin - lucky guy in the easiest division. NOOOTTT. got beat to a pulp twice by anderson.
Tim Sylvia - boring, just walks around and jabs hoping something will catch you.
Rampage - No he is not the best LHW in the world, he got KO'ed 2x by Wand BAD and KO'ed BAD again against Shogun. dont matter if you fight either of them again, he'll still lose and by knees again.
Joe Stevenson

**Nods Head**

Chuck sure did get lucky an ass load of times! lol wow. Rampage overrated?... okay? I dont think anyone overrates Hughes anymore but he had his time and so far has been the most dominant WW in history. I dont think anyone overrates Tim Sylvia at all lol. Anyways I'll stop now.

[willpunisher]

Originally Posted by thecoylewis

There you go. You spoke your mind. I may disagree with you on most of your list but the point is, you spoke your mind.

I had more a problem with the lack of punctuation and complete sentences than you compiling your list. Good effort though.

sorry english is not my first language.

[Canes]

I think Rampage gets overrated at times. He is one of the best LHW's in the world, but he isn't the top P4P fighter yet that a lot of people make him out to be. I see a lot of people putting him up there with Silva, Fedor, GSP, and Penn in there P4P list. Personally I think he is clearly behind those 4 fighters.

Maybe he will be soon, but there are still too many top LHW's that he hasn't beaten.

[cpac77]

Originally Posted by Mac

I've got a top 10 of my own, overrated fighters. Now this isn't necessarilly all about where they are ranked but also the amount of exposure they get. Without further ado.

10. Thiago Silva ( good record, but against who? We will see after Wandy fight)
9. Nick Diaz (working out a deal to use his face instead of little white glove on Hamburger helper boxes)
8. Robbie Lawler (shot up the ranks for becoming Elite MW champ)
7. Tim Sylvia (really hasn't been the devastating striker he was before that positive test?)
6. Dennis Kang (was said that he would wreak havoc on the MW division because of hugely padded record)
5. Matt Serra (TUF catapulted largely marginal fighter to fame, fluke KO of GSP made him world champ, utter domination in second fight showed the truth)
4. Randy Couture (16-8 record doesn't seem like proof that the only thing left for you to prove is to fight Fedor)
3. Phil Baroni (.500 fighter who seems to get more airtime than most champs?)
2. Tito Ortiz (great self promoter who has proven very little in the octagon over past couple of years)
1. Kimbo Slice (Duh!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

OK, go ahead and flame, I am sure some people may have intelligent replies or even their own additions.

Well my only problem with a few names on this list is that they aren't overrated... everyone knows they absolutely suck. Nobody will tell you that Kimbo is a top 50 HW. Nobody will tell you that Baroni is a top 50 MW.
I love the Randy comment, that is so true. Before he showed the world how much of a jackass he is, people were on his nuts hardcore for beating GG & Timmay. Now look at GG, one more loss and he is gone. Timmay is already gone and about to have one of his limbs permanently removed.

I'm on the fence about Tito. I know he sucks, but he could probably carry any LHW belt except the UFCs (Stann might knock his ass out too).

Thiago, I don't think he is being nuthugged yet so it's hard for me to call him overrated. He hasn't fought any top tier guys but I think he has earned his chance to find out if he is one himself. Too bad it's against Wandy. Instead of Thiago on that list, I would put Jardine in his spot.

Nick Diaz claim to fame was destroying Gomi. I still think that win was legit, regardless of the NC bullshit. Other than that, he hasn't done anything. He hasn't even been able to hold gold in another org. So I do get what your saying, he isn't a top tier guy... but who ever said he was?

Robbie Lawler is an interesting choice. He opened my eyes by beating Ninja. He was also picking Scott Smith apart, but then again these two guys aren't top tier fighters. Watching Robbie recently though, I think he is going to surprise people by getting better and better over time. It seems like he is really maturing well as a fighter. I bet you he hangs on to that belt for awhile. I wouldn't be surprised to see him back with the big boys in the UFC within five years either.

Timmay is another interesting choice. I agree with him being on the list, but if he hangs in there with Fedor and either wins or loses a close fight.... he gets taken off the list.

I haven't seen Kang yet so I can't comment. I agree with Serra. I like Serra, I'm glad he got his fame and all of that but he can't ever be considered a top 10 guy. His UFC resume is littered with 'who cares' and then theres the big upset.

And Baroni shouldn't be there, everyone knows he sucks. He just gets airtime because its EXC, and people like watching Baroni talk shit and get destroyed.

[rivethead]

A wise man once said only pussies make lists that don't go to 20...even if they're subjective:

20: GSP by anyone who somehow has him #1 p4p.
19: Glamrock, [by me, until recently]
18: Kimbo...would be higher if anyone besides Gary Shaw thought he was great.
17: Alexander somehow still gets hype on the forum.
16: Horodecki...would be higher on the list if he wasn't exposed by Shultz
15: Guida...I like him, and he's exciting, but not great
14: Huerta...I hope his time off filled the holes in his game
13: Stann solid fighter, but overhyped...and it will get worse if he goes to the UFC
12: Evans...has a good skillset and people mistake it for great
11: Filho...anyone thinking he'd beat Franklin is severely overrating him. I like him and hope he comes back strong though...
10: Bisping is just average, should rematch Hamill
09: Sherk...by anyone who still thinks he'll finish fights against quality opponents
08: Nick Diaz...I like Nick, but he desperately needs to learn head movement, TDs and TDD.
07: Thiago Silva by anyone who thinks he deserves a shot right now
06: Vera will never hold the HW belt, unless someone lets him borrow it
05: Tito is perpetually hurt and distracted and should just retire
04: Leben...is not greatly skilled, but has a lot of fans who think brawling is an art
03: Mir does not deserve a title shot with wins over Lesnar and Hardonk
02: Lesnar may amount to something someday, but for now he's average
01: Hamill...based entirely off the posters who can't tell the difference between Division I and III and were recently thinking he'd beat Franklin and making stuff up about heavy hands/good striking.

rh

[hunterkiller]

Originally Posted by rivethead

A wise man once said only pussies make lists that don't go to 20...even if they're subjective:

20: GSP by anyone who somehow has him #1 p4p.
19: Glamrock, [by me, until recently]
18: Kimbo...would be higher if anyone besides Gary Shaw thought he was great.
17: Alexander somehow still gets hype on the forum.
16: Horodecki...would be higher on the list if he wasn't exposed by Shultz
15: Guida...I like him, and he's exciting, but not great
14: Huerta...I hope his time off filled the holes in his game
13: Stann solid fighter, but overhyped...and it will get worse if he goes to the UFC
12: Evans...has a good skillset and people mistake it for great
11: Filho...anyone thinking he'd beat Franklin is severely overrating him. I like him and hope he comes back strong though...
10: Bisping is just average, should rematch Hamill
09: Sherk...by anyone who still thinks he'll finish fights against quality opponents
08: Nick Diaz...I like Nick, but he desperately needs to learn head movement, TDs and TDD.
07: Thiago Silva by anyone who thinks he deserves a shot right now
06: Vera will never hold the HW belt, unless someone lets him borrow it
05: Tito is perpetually hurt and distracted and should just retire
04: Leben...is not greatly skilled, but has a lot of fans who think brawling is an art
03: Mir does not deserve a title shot with wins over Lesnar and Hardonk
02: Lesnar may amount to something someday, but for now he's average
01: Hamill...based entirely off the posters who can't tell the difference between Division I and III and were recently thinking he'd beat Franklin and making stuff up about heavy hands/good striking.

rh

I can't believe it but I strongly agree with 98 percent of this post. Great list and great reasoning.

[Mac]

Originally Posted by cpac77

Well my only problem with a few names on this list is that they aren't overrated... everyone knows they absolutely suck. Nobody will tell you that Kimbo is a top 50 HW. Nobody will tell you that Baroni is a top 50 MW.

Once again, in my original post it states this isn't all about rankings but I included people that get alot of attention and or are overhyped.

@Rivethead- Good job I was actually thinking about doing 20 but it took me so long to narrow it down to 10 that I said fuck it. I was going to do honorable mention for guys like Vera, Mir and Guida.

The only real problem I have with your list is Filho. He's an undefeated champion. If he comes back from his rehab and is less than stellar then maybe I would agree, and as far as Franklin goes, there is nothing that shows me he wouldn't get subbed by Filho, Lutter came awfull close.

[deeznizzies]

i think calling randy overrated is kinda bs but to each their own.... a .500 record doesn't make you just average... look at who he lost to and how old he was when he first began mma. i think he's won a lot of fights against fighters that at that time, he was not supposed to beat (vitor 2x, chuck 1x, rizzo, tito, gonzaga and sylvia).... but anyway, here's my list:


10)royce gracie.... i know this is an old school choice but i just don't think he ever was as good as people made him out to be.. his opponents were just that bad at jj during that time.

9)brian stann.... definitely a lil' too hyped up right now in the WEC. needs to fight some real contenders at 205... i'd like to see him vrs the winner of irvin and silva just to see him potentially ktfo.

8)rashad evans... i want to see him beat a top guy at 205 before i start thinking he's ready for a title shot.

7)melvin guillard.... he was so hyped after TUF and people were talking about how he would be a great match for gomi..... that's crazy talk.

6)kevin randleman.... i think the reason for this is pretty obvious... people really thought he was going to dominate everyone with his strength and athleticism... he turned out to be a juice head and a lay n' prayer at that... not good combos imo.

5)mark coleman.... same as randleman.. these dudes just refused to evolve

4)vitor belfort.... he still has some time to prove otherwise but he really has built a career off his wanderlei win back in the day. i think he's got all the potential in the world... hope he can show it before its too late.

3)gil melendez.... i put this one with a lot of hesitation.. but people were already calling him a top 3 or 5 lw... i think his last two loses kinda show maybe he's not quite at the top of the weight class just yet.....

2)filho.... i think he is a great mw.. but not the top 3 or 5 like people want to make him out to be.

1) RICKSON GRACIE..... this should be pretty damn obvious... who the fuck has he beat for him to be so arrogant to believe that at 50 some years of age, he can beat fedor and only bjj is necessary for success in mma? his legacy, imo, is a fabrication.

[rivethead]

Originally Posted by Mac

The only real problem I have with your list is Filho. He's an undefeated champion. If he comes back from his rehab and is less than stellar then maybe I would agree, and as far as Franklin goes, there is nothing that shows me he wouldn't get subbed by Filho, Lutter came awfull close.

I like Filho...I just don't think he's was a great as people said, and I have more doubt than I did before with his addiction stuff. People were saying a day or so ago that he'd sub Franklin, and I'm just not buying it, particularly until we get the rematch with Sonnen in [September? I think??]

I'd counter the Franklin/Lutter MMA math with Filho/Sonnen MMA math...Sonnen--who is not the fighter Rich is--was dominant before the controversial stop.

I like Filho quite a lot, and I want him to come back strong. Although I actually like the WEC set-up better, I wouldn't even be disappointed for the MW and LHW d's to get folded into the UFC as rumored. He's for sure a top 5 MW, potentially as high as 2...but nothing is definative on him right now.

But I think people saying Filho are going to simply take Franklin down and sub him [worse, some are saying he'd sub A.Silva as well] are overrating him.

rh

[Mac]

Originally Posted by rivethead

I like Filho...I just don't think he's was a great as people said, and I have more doubt than I did before with his addiction stuff. People were saying a day or so ago that he'd sub Franklin, and I'm just not buying it, particularly until we get the rematch with Sonnen in [September? I think??]

I'd counter the Franklin/Lutter MMA math with Filho/Sonnen MMA math...Sonnen--who is not the fighter Rich is--was dominant before the controversial stop.

I like Filho quite a lot, and I want him to come back strong. Although I actually like the WEC set-up better, I wouldn't even be disappointed for the MW and LHW d's to get folded into the UFC as rumored. He's for sure a top 5 MW, potentially as high as 2...but nothing is definative on him right now.

But I think people saying Filho are going to simply take Franklin down and sub him [worse, some are saying he'd sub A.Silva as well] are overrating him.

rh

Fair enough, I base my feelings on Filho from pre-addiction/WEC days, so like I said, if he comes back and doesn't look like the old Filho then I will agree.

Hell, it could turn out he will never be like Pride Filho, there is a big chance his problems stem from steroid use. That would suck because he's one of my faves. If true I will call a spade a spade and move on, heavy hearted of course.